How To Wet Sand And Polish Paint

theMIDrange

Let's say you're doing a solid color. You probably wet sand between applications? only on the last spray, do you wet sand that as well or just leave it to dry a couple weeks prior to articulate nitro over superlative?

I've been wetsanding to 2000 prior to clear, but cannot get rid o small swirl marks which wouldn't exist in that location had I not wetsanded the concluding paint glaze...simply then it wouldn't be the correct look I don't believe. I seem to want to wetsand the concluding pigment coat..

any ideas?

Michael_P

swirl marks?

you lot hateful orangish skin?

to me, swirl marks are what is seen as a result of many types of polishing gone 'wrong'.

anyway, with lacquers, many times sanding between coats is non required...why? because lacquer's solvents consume into the previous coats and bonding occurs creating, for all intensive purposes, a continuous product even though it'south multiple layers of application...your statement of waiting a couple of weeks until articulate would be a case where you would need to sand earlier applying...if y'all applied clear inside, IIRC, three days, sanding would non be required...

please be aware that I am making statements as pertaining to a non catalyzed product...air dry lacquers take around 30 days to accomplish good curing, and there are unlike rules as to how one approaches time betwixt coats.

the big motion-picture show is that it's the smoothness of the clear coating that makes the difference...ane will of course be wet sanding and polishing that layer to get in shine similar a show machine!

equally long as you don't sand through the clear and get into the color all should be thou...if yous nick the colour, then you lot are hosed, and this would be an statement in favor of sanding the final colour coat...

theMIDrange

I just use inexpensive black hardware store paint. It ends upwards looking great, I just want to try and dial it in more. So past swirl marks I mean merely marks due to sandpaper (concluded at 2000 grit).

At that place is a touch or orange skin as well simply it'due south non too large an issue....actually like yous say the clear is probably more key. I've done this on past projects and most the swirl disapperas nether the clear but I thought i'd ask to see virtually possibly improving this fourth dimension.

so it sounds like wet sanding the pigment is not a common practice.....I practise it because it seems to give a good cease product. But then again i've never Non wet sanded the paint so I don't know how better or worse it would end up non moisture sanded.

I too lightly relic the end product so I really don't need the ltop level task almost need. but the modest sandpaper swirl marks would exist nice to totally remove. I'll try a 4000 grit

pshupe

Generally color coats are so sparse that you do not sand them. Wet sanding is for leveling. I do not even moisture sand until my final coat of articulate. I've just sprayed bursts so do not know whether building colour coats helps in anyhow. I tin't think of why it would. One coat of an opaque colour should get yous where you lot want, correct? And then y'all build up clear on top of that. a lot of people sand in betwixt a sure number of coats of articulate, just again that is to level the surface so you don't end up having to sand a ton to get a level surface on your last coat of clear, after curing.

Regards Peter.

87hdrush

this link is about colour sanding cars. IMO the process is the same for hand rubbed lacquer. Yous tin can tell the divergence in the depth of the finish if you color sand earlier spraying the clear. small difference but noticeable. Color Sanding - Wet sanding or Color Sanding ?

Michael_P

color sanding too can affect the color depth...

upon reflection, I would have to say yous'd want to level sand the glaze before your concluding colour and then shoot the clear if possible...

if a metallic pigment is being used, then definitely NO sanding of the terminal coat every bit that volition mess with a lot of things...

TKOjams

What type of finish are you using? Lacquer, or Poly?

292fan

the link that 87hdrush posted is pretty spot on for almost any finished paint, especially if your using an enamel sprayed out of a professional paint gun, if using spray bombs be very careful non to burn through the paint, its very easy to burn through, spray bombs tend to exist thin coats, and in some cases produce what is chosen dry spray,the paint is mostly dry before information technology hits the painting surface, causing an effect that looks similar you painted right over grit. careful moisture sanding, followed by a cut and buff can produce in incredible looking finish even with spray bombs,lots of even coats is the best method I've found for spray paint, light moisture sanding( 2000 grit or finer) in between coats just to smooth out the imperfections( runs, dips, dry spray etc), my method is primer however many coats it takes to smooth out the trunk, sanding between each coat until body is smoothen, so base color, 4 or 5 coats, sand out imperfections, then articulate coat, ten to xv coats, I like to bury everything under a heavy clear, sanding out imperfections in between coats, after assuasive to dry for a couple days, I and so final cut and buff, using professional class swirl remover and buffing compound, usually 3m brand. if using multiple color(for graphics or patterns) use the same method every bit the base color then utilize the articulate. if using stickers or any kind of adhesive attached graphics, be certain you cheque that the adhesive material, wont react to your paint of pick. other wise the out come can exist very ugly, and mayhap equal stripping the surface all the fashion down and starting over. aforementioned goes for the primer, base colors, and articulate coat, always utilize the same brand, if non possible, read the tin and match upwardly the solvents.

theMIDrange · May 25, 2016

so I'm into my black spray tin can paint gibson......I read that link. thank you. that was a good explanation. I learned that color sanding is moisture sanding paint and 'wet sanding' is wet sanding the articulate post paint. And then that term I was not aware. Makes sense now

But

I've got several coats paint on, looks adept. I have been color sanding until last coat which is pretty darn nice and I have not color sanded this last coat YET....What I don't understand is this. When I leave the last color awarding unsanded, it is glossy (using basic black gloss). It does have a flake orange skin. The orange peel tin can smooth out when colour sanding merely when I colour sand it looks satin and not gloss. The article is saying colorsanding results in more and deeper compared to just wet sanding. I guess the gloss I come across at present when leaving terminal coat non color sanded has zilch to practice with stop product. Colour sand so clear so wet sand will result in more gloss right? even though when at color sand pace, it deglosses.....? yes.

I am at the indicate where I can choose to color sand my final coat and smooth orange peel or get out orange peel and go to clear stage.......this door panel looks like what I get when color sanding. Clearly it dulls the entire thing, simply obviously this is natural. https://www.youtube.com/scout?v=5hzQyaRof4k

but in the next vid he used 2000 grit and 4000 and information technology starts to polish and not dull it like 1000 did. then the pigment is buffed then it is cleared?

This is where i'1000 unsure. Is that right? Is the pigment wetsanded and buffed all prior to clear? and then clear is applied and again buffed?

It's even so not clear. Should the paint wait hazy or clear right prior to clearcoating?

bmac6502

Everyone does it differently. It depends on your approach and the product you employ, you simply have to develop your ain strategy to some extent. Some don't practice much sanding until the very stop. Others sand betwixt every coat. The basic principle is but to keep every coat equally level as possible without sanding through, and just aggressively sand and buff the final coat. Not the final "color". I mean the *final* glaze - the very last thing you spray. There is no point (and probably some impairment) in buffing before the very final coat. Don't worry that previous coats look boring - unless yous get out visible scratches in them, the side by side glaze will fill in over the top and make it look seamless. The gloss all comes from the very acme surface.

The glossy stop is all washed at the last coat. If you are spraying clear, spray all the clear. You lot can sand at to the lowest degree a flake between coats if your orange skin is likewise high, but your goal is just to try to give a mostly level surface for the next coat to lay down on top. After you are all done spraying, sand all the mode out to at to the lowest degree 2000, higher if you want, and and so you tin can buff. The higher you get, the less yous need to buff.

It feels counter intuitive - when you lot spray it looks glossy, but with a piffling orange skin, and and so y'all have to sand it out dull. Information technology feels like you lot were really close, and then ruining information technology on purpose, but that'southward what you accept to do. At the end, when you lot have a completely flat, smooth, just boring surface, the buffing of the top coat brings out the glassy surface.

Michael_P

what he said...buffing will leave contaminants on the colour coat...it's the articulate that is going to make information technology smooth securely.

theMIDrange

so, I decided to colour sand the last awarding color and again, it smooths out nice and level but in that location where scratches behind 2000 dust....so I added a touch buffing compund and with a micro fibre towel, mitt done the last color coat. for some reason this easily and rapidly disappeared most scratches and it looks nice. I did this on the previous coat every bit well and put the last colour over it. I was concerned that little fleck of buffing compound would crusade issues with paint sticking merely it didn't. And then I imagine that little chip of compound on this last coat will not crusade bug with the clear going over it?

292fan

the reason the buffing compound takes care of the tiny scratches that you are seeing, is because it is a much finer abrasive then the 2000 grit newspaper, so well information technology is still the same concept as the sandpaper, it is on a small plenty scale, that instead of seeing scratches and wearisome paint, it starts to bring out the luster or shine of the pigment, and when washed correctly on the height coat/final coat of clear information technology can get in expect similar glass. as to your final question, I have no idea if it will react with your clear, in theory as long as you accept removed all of the chemical compound off of the guitar torso earlier spraying the next coat, which if your mitt washing the torso, you lot should be fine. if you lot wanted to be absolutely sure, yous could requite the paint a couple of days to cure, and and then pick up a production called Prep-all [ame]http://www.amazon.com/Kleanstrip-GSW362-Grease-Remover-Gallon/dp/B008QDSVPE/ref=sr_1_1/187-4238751-7581751?ie=UTF8&qid=1464273326&sr=8-i&keywords=prep+all[/ame] it and similar products are used by painters to remove whatsoever and all contaminates that may exist on the pigment that could cause a reaction. then subsequently wiping downward the torso with the prep-all(information technology will evaporate off the guitar), start applying your articulate glaze, information technology tin accept a lot of work, just after the beginning fourth dimension you get the cut and smoothen correct and the concluding product looks like a mirror, yous'll be hooked. and even if information technology something does go wrong, its merely paint.

theMIDrange

thanks for the link. I wonder if a little dab or two of lighter fluid could be substituted to help evaoprate/clean whatever polishing rest? Because I have that handy at the moment.....simply I concord, this colorsanding looks to exist worth the try....

so my private best practice routine at this point, trying to become good results with inexpensive spray pigment and a minimal sanding setup is:

one coat primer, several coats paint, colorsanding each fourth dimension. The last paint awarding gets a scrap of polishing chemical compound and buff. Then a wet wash and/or residue clean (using an evaporative product). And so nitro clear (stemac rattle tin can). This clear gets same polish handling equally paint colorsand did.

I will wait 4 weeks to permit pigment dry prior to clearcoating.

Other tools are 400-2000 wet dry newspaper, a pocket-size sanding block. simple and inexpensive. Starting to get results compared to the dozen other guitars i've painted similarly. The knowledge of what colorsanding is compared to clear wetsanding is the new piece to my organization.......yes ideally one should use a hplv sprayer, quality paint etc. Just money's tight so this setup will take to piece of work.

Michael_P

thanks for the link. I wonder if a piffling dab or two of lighter fluid could be substituted to aid evaoprate/clean whatever polishing residue? Considering I have that handy at the moment.....simply I agree, this colorsanding looks to be worth the endeavour....
and then my individual best do routine at this bespeak, trying to become good results with cheap spray paint and a minimal sanding setup is:

i coat primer, several coats paint, colorsanding each time. The concluding paint awarding gets a bit of polishing chemical compound and buff. Then a wet launder and/or residue make clean (using an evaporative product). And then nitro clear (stemac rattle can). This articulate gets same smoothen treatment as paint colorsand did.

I will wait four weeks to permit paint dry prior to clearcoating.

Other tools are 400-2000 wet dry paper, a small sanding block. simple and cheap. Starting to get results compared to the dozen other guitars i've painted similarly. The noesis of what colorsanding is compared to articulate wetsanding is the new piece to my organisation.......yeah ideally one should use a hplv sprayer, quality pigment etc. Only coin's tight and so this setup will have to work.

if yous look 4 weeks to articulate glaze you will demand to scuff the stop with sandpaper...this is just a uncomplicated rule of lacquers...and if you're not using lacquer, it is a NECESSITY...

lacquers melt into the previous coats by solvent reaction...simply, if three-5 days have passed, it's a rule to scuff the previous coats...this opens up the finish to solvents still in there, just deeper downwardly...hard to put into words, but I get the gist of the rule...

with other finishes, the scratches give a mechanical bond for the next glaze to grab into...

either way, buffing the color coat was a waste of time pretty much...no reason in the world to do so...if y'all had sanded to 2000 and then started spraying clear lacquer inside three days yous would have been golden...and equally noted if you're non using lacquer then scuffing with at least 220 grit (or dull 220 dust) is rather required for adherence...

I've shot over 50 gallons of lacquer in my life and am rather familiar with its characteristics...other finishes, no...best knowledge I can give near that is the following: been a carpenter for years...part of that job is doing hardware, which entails putting chisels to painted forest...ane builder I deal with has painters that are using 320 grit sandpaper between coats and become a existent prissy, smooth finish..trouble is those coats don't bail worth a flip...when I have to chisel in fifty-fifty a square corner for a pre-routed strike plate on a jamb paint goes flying every where...and I'grand talking about a chisel sharp plenty to shave the hair off of the back of my hand...yet other builders take painters that, while their final product is not so smooth and 'perfect', have used 220 dust betwixt coats and I have very little to no bug chiseling into...indicate existence, scratches deep enough to allow a expert mechanical bail are required for paints (and yeah Dorothy, articulate is a pigment) that don't have solvent reaction tendencies like lacquers

theMIDrange

cheers much. basically i'one thousand trying to get results with low cost and moderate tools.....even with many years experience it is a task when $ and tools are low! It's pretty close to pro imo Skillful enuph 4 rok northward roll.....it will be naturally relic'd in no time anyhow!

real happy with these results

292fan

real happy with these results

and in the long run this is all that matters.

Michael_P

thanks much. basically i'm trying to get results with low toll and moderate tools.....even with many years experience it is a job when $ and tools are depression! It's pretty shut to pro imo Adept enuph 4 rok northward coil.....information technology will be naturally relic'd in no time anyhow!
real happy with these results

look, not trying to hound you or annihilation, but being happy with the results is a relative statement...

when I'm doing a new finish job (please note, I'grand a carpenter with 30 years experience, non a painter...I exercise information technology now and once again, but it's even so a fleck of a mystery to me, that being qualified pay attending to this) I do a test console...desired stain, or not, and finishing schedule with chosen product...

then I test said panel...hit information technology with a hammer a few times...what I want to see is ideally the stop angle into the dent and not flaking off or somesuch...rub the ribbed bottom of a beer bottle on it and observe the effects...and finally try to take the stop off with my thumb blast...if my thumb can take the terminate off information technology'south [email protected] that is what I worry nearly if you don't properly scuff the cease before your clear coats...

relic'd is sooooo relative...any scratches in the color coat will disappear afterward clear (well, unless they're divots the size of the G Coulee) and what yous really want is to sand and buff the clear to a showroom shine, neh?

but hey, if you desire the look of layers of clear falling off and that makes y'all happy, then become ahead...

using rattle tin engineering science for your finish is not an effect...permit's exist real here...when you take the time to wet sand then polish, then a rattle can compares to whatsoever other method...

said other methods, and yeah I have a nice Binks Mach1-SL HLVP setup running off of a pressure pot, are more for production environments...in a guitar factory, college efficiency of getting product onto guitar and less waste of product floating away...in the field, where you don't wet sand and polish, a smoother concluding coat which means a lot...

again, if you're going to take the time to wet sand etc., the rattle can ain't a bad way to practise! yes, my system cost a fair penny, and that was acquired for an in the field project where not only did I practice the forest piece of work, I likewise did the finishing...at that bespeak in time I had a Binks 2000 loftier force per unit area setup, and considering the cost savings of paint to be used on that projection, the Mach1 paid for itself by it'southward efficiency...uncomplicated math...and a better finish too kicking!

point being, I get your penny pinching...and totally appreciate it...no issues hither...

Simply...there are schedules to finishing, developed past simple logic (agreement the 'rules' of the game) and experience...

theMIDrange

mayhap with a college quality spray paint i wouldn't need to colorsand. But i'grand using $ane cans and it merely does not become on well enough on its own. Once its color sanded it looks nicer. I understand modest scratches may disappear post articulate. Only the concluding coat, to add a small polish on a microtowel only took one minute and it really made the pigment almost wait like a mirror. it looks like it'southward got a fleck o clear already. I nevertheless color sand each awarding too (well-nigh 3-4 sessions o paint).... In any example i've been using these $i cans about 6 years and this is the best results i've gotten to this point.

I too tried a $6 tin can and it did not go on whatever improve, just thicker and ran no matter how calorie-free application, so i've build my technique around these articular $i cans and I gauge similar the other poster mentioned information technology'south all nearly the particular materials and process that gets results in each individual case. I've got a white V using aforementioned pigment in process and will postal service pics. Getting results on that one as well ....although the black is the i that really shows up scrathes post 2000 dust. Tin can hardly see these same scratches in white....

Fret Hopper

Merely my.02. I sprayed a body with primer, level sanded that, and so shot color which came out looking flat. No gloss what then always.

Shot about 4-5 coats of clear and it looks just beautiful. Depth and gloss similar I never expected. Follow the steps they have laid out for you in a higher place and you will amaze yourself.

From the ozone...

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